Re: seamless updates

[Andy Burnelli]

badgolferman wrote:

> Samsung has rejected seamless updates. Does Apple use this method? I know
> it downloads updates in the background while I continue to use the phone
> but I don¢t know if that's the same thing.
> <https://www.androidpolice.com/samsung-galaxy-s23-seamless-updates/>

Alan Browne opined:

> As to Android seamless updates, they are not actually seamless. They
> strive to minimize the downtime while preserving the current loaded
> (former) OS while the future load (new) OS is being installed. If
> something goes boink with the new load, the current OS can continue or
> be re-booted into (some assumption here).

Hi badgolferman,

What I am about to convey is an erudite _adult_ take on the penalty we all
pay for Apple's Draconian decision to build & release iOS as a Paleolithic
monolith which can _never_ be updated seamlessly as a direct result.

Since I don't own a pixel, I don't have any direct experience with A/B
updates myself, but I have plenty of experience with seamless OS updates.

To badgolferman, you have to understand Android isn't like iOS (which you
know in general, but you might not know in the specifics of OS updates).

Android (like all other operating systems _other_ than iOS of course), is
updated in asynchronous _layers_ (some of which are updated seamlessly).

By way of huge contrast, only iOS is completely different in its update
mechanism, which is best described as a primitive Draconian monolith.

I mean that, even as nospam will scream bloody murder that any one
individual device doesn't get the entire release if it doesn't need it, but
that's no different than saying any one iOS user doesn't get the complete
enema because it's Apple who prepares that monolithic release, not nospam.

You may note my cynicism in my portrayal of iOS as not only Paleolithic but
also as an enema, where the iKooks don't have the mental capacity to
understand all the inherent horrific drawbacks of a monolithic release.

Not only dies everything die sooner with iOS as a result of that monolith,
but iOS has the most zero-day exploits as a result of Apple's poorly
designed release mechanism.

Worse, as a direct result of that monolith, we poor Apple owners are
subjected to _multiple_ unnecessary enemas time after time after time.

All these unnecessary iOS enemas are due to the iOS monolith requiring the
entire operating system to be updated for _every_ bug that Apple is told
about from researchers (half of which are exploited in the wild).

Note the significance of what I am trying to explain to you, badgolferman.

Because half of these zero-day bugs are _already_ exploited in the wild by
the time Apple finds out about them, Apple must scramble to release the
_entire_ enema yet again (and again) (and again) and again and again.

BECAUSE of the monolith, badgolferman, you are subjected to numerous
unnecessary Apple iOS enemas, each of which is a significant event.

By way of stark contrast, Android isn't administered as a monolith.
Most of Android is updated seamlessly under the covers, forever.

As just one example, if Apple is told about an exploited hole in Safari
(which has had plenty), then Apple has to create an entire new iOS monolith
but, by way of contrast, if any other operating system other than the
primitive iOS monolith has a bug in, oh, say, Chrome, they do not.

They just seamlessly update Chrome in all operating systems not iOS.
And that, for Android, happens seamlessly in the background, does it not?

[Andy Burnelli]

sms wrote:

>> https://www.androidpolice.com/samsung-galaxy-s23-seamless-updates/
>
> Yes, Apple does "seamless" updates and Android does not.

Unfortunately, you, Steve, are clueless of how Android seamlessly updates.
(Paradoxically, the reason is _because_ those updates have been seamless!)

It depends on how you wish to define the generic word "seamless", where I'm
defining it as an update that occurs without the user even knowing it did.

Fact is, all common operating systems _other_ than iOS seamlessly update.

> I never thought about this much because the total time for an update
> doesn't differ much, in fact if you don't allow the iOS update to
> download before the update it can actually take longer than an Android
> update because of the way that iOS does updates.

*Android updates most of its layers seamlessly every single day.*
*Whether you ignorant iKooks understand that known fact. Or not.*
*In fact, it's so seamless, you don't even realize that it happens!*

The point that needs to be made is that Android is updated in _layers_.
The version number of the operating system is just _one_ of those layers.
Most of the Android layers are updated without the user even knowing it.

For example, if Apple is told of an exploit in the wild for Safari, the
entire primitive iOS monolith has to be built and distributed to everyone.

Meanwhile, in _every_ other operating system _other_ than iOS, if Google or
Microsoft are told of a bug in their default web browser, they simply have
to distribute a fix to that _single_ layer, in this case, the browser app.

This happens seamlessly in most cases, without the user even knowing it.

> I added this to the document
> <https://docs.google.com/document/d/1JznrWfGJDA8CYVfjSnPTwfVy8-gAC0kPyaApuJTcUNE/>
> as 51i on page 16.

Steve - you are wrong because you don't understand how Android updates.

There's no mention, for example, of the Android 10 and up project
mainstream updates, nor the project treble Qualcomm firmware updates.

Nor any mention of the fact that all apps can update "seamlessly" in the
background via a mechanism whose Activity is controlled by the user in the
Google Play Store app - but which is on by default for seamless updates.

> I also went through the document this morning and made some other
> corrections due to out-of-date information. Apple now has high-refresh
> LTPO displays on some models (beginning with the iPhone 13 Pro/Pro Max)
> so 23a is now struck-out. Wi-Fi calling now works on the iPhone with
> Google-Fi (iOS 15.4 or newer), though 5G still requires a kludgy
> workaround and requires the use of a physical SIM card.

Unfortunately, you, Steve, are clueless of how Android seamlessly updates.
(Paradoxically, the reason is _because_ those updates have been seamless!)

I doubt you (or anyone on this child-like newsgroup) has any understanding
of what I just informed you of, Steve, so I'll summarize it for all of you.

All of those are "seamless" in terms of it happening without the user even
being aware of it having been happening for years on end for Android 10+.

[Joerg Lorenz]

Am 04.02.23 um 17:58 schrieb Andy Burnelli:

> sms wrote:
>
>>> https://www.androidpolice.com/samsung-galaxy-s23-seamless-updates/
>>
>> Yes, Apple does "seamless" updates and Android does not.
>
> Unfortunately, you, Steve, are clueless of how Android seamlessly updates.
> (Paradoxically, the reason is _because_ those updates have been seamless!)

*ROTFLSTC*. Nothing with my Android devices lives up to the meaning of
seamless. Seamless means uninterrupted operation.


--
Gutta cavat lapidem (Ovid)

[Andy Burnelli]

nospam wrote:

>> I never thought about this much because the total time for an update
>> doesn't differ much, in fact if you don't allow the iOS update to
>> download before the update it can actually take longer than an Android
>> update because of the way that iOS does updates.
>

> your attempt to twist things fails.

If you're intelligent, you'll understand the facts I present below for your
edification; however, if you are a low-IQ uneducated person... you won't.

I doubt nospam (who knows nothing about how operating systems update) is
aware that if Apple is told of a zero-day hole in Safari, that an _entire_
new iOS subversion has to be built to fix it. *Every single bug*.

Meanwhile, for _every_ other (non primitive monolithic) operating system...

If a bug in Microsoft's Edge browser, or one in Google's Chrome browser is
found, _only_ the browser app itself needs to be updated.

*Not the entire OS* (with a new subversion).

I doubt anyone on this ng even _understands_ the significance of how
_seamless_ operating systems not iOS are in _layers_ seamlessly updating.

Paradoxically, the _reason_ people like Steve & nospam are ignorant that
all other common consumer operating systems update in _layers_ is a direct
result of how _seamless_ those layered updates truly are.

> the download happens in the background, which means no additional time
> is needed.

Almost all of Android, is updated over the Google Framework, seamlessly,
and completely independently of whatever subversion the OS currently has.

It's so seamless, users are usually completely unaware of layered updates!
<https://i.postimg.cc/fyRfSJqt/gpprotect03.jpg> Seamless App Updates

Just like the anti-virus scan on Android is completely seamless - so
seamless that people are generally completely unaware it runs every day.
<https://i.postimg.cc/vBzvmWhw/gpprotect02.jpg> Seamless AV Scans
--
My goal is always twofold on this newsgroup, one of which is to disseminate
useful information while being open to learning from others - and the other
is to expose the despicable low-IQ iKooks for the ignorant people they are.

[Andy Burnelli]

nospam wrote:

>> Plus the iOS image is significantly smaller than the Android image for
>> obvious reasons.
>
> conveniently neglecting to mention what they are.

Adult observation... (this post contains information people on this ng
will not be able to comprehend because of their lack of mental capacity).

*What exactly is the size difference between Android/iOS updates?*

It is an interesting question, the answer to which I doubt neither Steve
nor nospam (nor any of the low-IQ ignorant iKooks) own the mental capacity
to comprehend how _differently_ the two operating systems actually update.

To put it succinctly for those who don't understand operating systems...
a. All operating systems _other_ than iOS update in asynchronous layers.
b. Only iOS updates in using the primitively Paleolithic monolith
c. But even so, iOS breaks down that monolith individually for each device.

That means, for example, on _my_ iOS devices (which are rarely updated),
the iOS monolith will be hugely larger than on, oh say, nospam's device,
which he likely updates every single time Apple pushes out a new release.

> is the smaller and more efficient code size of ios listed in your
> 'document'? rhetorical question.

*What exactly is the size difference between Android/iOS updates?*

Given it's obvious that neither nospam nor Steve even _understands_ that
iOS updates differently than _all_ other common consumer operating systems,
I doubt there is a simple answer to the "code size" question as a result.

The whole iOS monolith has to be built if Apple is told about a Webkit flaw
exploited in the wild that requires only a single line of code to fix.

Yet, for any individual user, only that "portion" of the iOS code that
changed between their prior release and this new release, gets updated.

It's not clear that nospam or Steve comprehends what I just explained.

Likewise, for Android, the Google Framework has a switch (on by default),
which seamlessly updates only the one Chrome app which has that update.

Who is to say which of those two "one line" updates is larger or smaller?

>> I suppose Google could limit seamless updates to phones with at least
>> 64GB of storage but there' not a reason to spend a lot of effort on this
>> feature since almost no one really cares about it.
>
> there you go again, when any time android can't do something, 'nobody
> really cares about it' despite evidence to the contrary, yet you're
> happy to mention things that favour android which really do not matter
> at all.

*What exactly is the size difference between Android/iOS updates?*

Unfortunately, nospam, the horribly ugly thing about your personality is
that you own no tenets of common behavior in that every accusation you make
of Steve is actually what you do all the time, far more than Steve does it.

On this, badgolferman recently called you out, where he's one of the few
adults on this newsgroup - so you should have taken heed when he did that.

Your inner personality is so appalling, nospam, so unseemly, that you
always project your own loathsome personal traits onto people like Steve.

>> You do an update and
>> a few minutes later it's done. Splitting up the time between "download"
>> and "install" is not buying you much.
>
> actually, it does, which is one reason why it's split.

*What exactly is the size difference between Android/iOS updates?*

If any adults are on this newsgroup, the question to answer is what are the
size differences given how completely differently the monolithic iOS
updates compared to how Android (and all other common operating systems)
update.

To oversimplify for the least educated people on this ng to grasp...
a. Android updates in _layers_, each of which can be different in size
b. iOS updates monolithically - but - each device update is tailored
for that device - so the size is dependent on device-specific factors.

Having expended appreciable information in the above post, I doubt there is
a single person on the Apple newsgroup who owns the adult mental capacity
to comprehend a single word I said, but whether or not you can comprehend
these facts, one of my goals is to disseminate the truth to everyone.

Whether or not you own the mental capacity to comprehend what I explained.
--
This is posted because I have two goals on this newsgroup, one of which is
to learn and disseminate useful information; information which most people
don't appear to have the basic mental capacity to even begin to comprehend.